From wear-hard-request@haven.org Wed Aug 5 23:07:40 1998 Received: from xenia.media.mit.edu ([18.85.4.17]:3025 "EHLO xenia.media.mit.edu" ident: "NO-IDENT-SERVICE[2]") by picton.eecg.utoronto.ca with ESMTP id <34572-27583>; Wed, 5 Aug 1998 23:07:28 -0400 Received: from aleve.media.mit.edu (aleve.media.mit.edu [18.85.2.171]) by xenia.media.mit.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA05785 for ; Wed, 5 Aug 1998 23:07:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from opal.haven.org (list@opal.haven.org [205.161.40.31]) by aleve.media.mit.edu (8.8.7/ML970927) with ESMTP id XAA16430; Wed, 5 Aug 1998 23:06:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from list@localhost) by opal.haven.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA03677; Wed, 5 Aug 1998 22:45:48 -0400 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 Aug 1998 22:45:48 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: luthien.arda.org: ladamson owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 5 Aug 1998 22:45:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Lee Adamson X-Sender: ladamson@luthien.arda.org To: mann@eecg.utoronto.ca cc: wear-hard@haven.org Subject: Re: Viewfinder Question... In-Reply-To: <19980805185943Z34572-27581+122@picton.eecg.utoronto.ca> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"ojMD12.0.tu.-XHor"@opal.haven.org> Resent-From: wear-hard@haven.org X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/4197 X-Loop: wear-hard@haven.org Precedence: list Resent-Sender: wear-hard-request@haven.org Return-Path: X-Orcpt: rfc822;mann@eecg.toronto.edu Status: RO On Wed, 5 Aug 1998 mann@eecg.utoronto.ca wrote: > what you've come across is probably a "real" viewfinder, e.g. one that > can properly display 80x25 text (presume you have 80 col card or the like > in the apple computer -- http://wearcam.org/wearhow/node4.html). It's actually a Laser 128, but yes, it has the equivalent of a 128K 80-col card. The focusing lens is rather poor, and causes the text around the edges to become unreadable, but this should be fairly easy to replace. > you should get the viewfinder displaying ntsc any way possible (such as > in-situ, in the original system), then measure with scope the waveforms > to see which is sync and which is video. It takes two separate composite inputs, and seems to run off of 12vdc. There is a switch to choose between inputs. Hehe- I think I may try attaching a small infrared camera ($162 last time I checked http://www.allcorp.com - no lens, I believe) as well. > measure the video too, to see if it needs level shift, etc., make from simple > op amp. The inputs are NTSC levels, not TTL. > careful, as voltages typically up to 5000 volts in typical "real" > viewfinders. Indeed. I nearly electrocuted myself once trying to fix an old monitor. :) The one-hand rule is the best thing since peach pie. > when done, email me your findings mann@eecg.toronto.edu > if you'd like them included in the wearhow (wearcam.org/wearhow/index.html) > or the review of wearcomp displays. Well, here is what it looks like so far. I am not completely sure of this info, nor is it complete, but here is what I know so far: Male DIN-8 (on viewfinder): 4 3 5 2 8 6 1 7 6- Video input #1 4- +12v shield- ground (duh :) There seems to be no output from the camera on any other pins except 3, which according to my (terribly in need of calibration) 'scope is a constant 1 volt on pin 3. I had no external video source connected at the time, so I don't know which pin takes video #2 (yet). Panasonic no longer supports this device, and I found no documents containing the part number and panasonic on an altavista search. :( I shall examine it further (and provide more info) if I am able to purchase the device. For now, I am afraid I might break it (like I did my first one. :( ). -- Subcription/unsubscription/info requests: send e-mail with subject of "subscribe", "unsubscribe", or "info" to wear-hard-request@haven.org Wear-Hard Mailing List Archive (searchable): http://wearables.ml.org From wear-hard-request@haven.org Thu Aug 6 03:32:42 1998 Received: from xenia.media.mit.edu ([18.85.4.17]:3240 "EHLO xenia.media.mit.edu" ident: "NO-IDENT-SERVICE[2]") by picton.eecg.utoronto.ca with ESMTP id <34585-27579>; Thu, 6 Aug 1998 03:32:21 -0400 Received: from aleve.media.mit.edu (aleve.media.mit.edu [18.85.2.171]) by xenia.media.mit.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA06677 for ; Thu, 6 Aug 1998 03:32:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from opal.haven.org (list@opal.haven.org [205.161.40.31]) by aleve.media.mit.edu (8.8.7/ML970927) with ESMTP id DAA04883; Thu, 6 Aug 1998 03:32:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from list@localhost) by opal.haven.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA07319; Thu, 6 Aug 1998 03:12:23 -0400 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 03:12:23 -0400 Message-ID: <003301bdc10a$00005f20$d375fea9@bester> From: "Matthew J Backes" To: "wearbles list" Subject: Re: Viewfinder Question... Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 00:15:31 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"V1OH51.0.yn1.2TLor"@opal.haven.org> Resent-From: wear-hard@haven.org X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/4201 X-Loop: wear-hard@haven.org Precedence: list Resent-Sender: wear-hard-request@haven.org Return-Path: X-Orcpt: rfc822;mann@eecg.toronto.edu Status: RO >It's actually a Laser 128, but yes, it has the equivalent of a 128K 80-col >card. The focusing lens is rather poor, and causes the text around the Keep in mind that Apple ]['s and their clones (though the laser is radically different under the hood) don't put out a true NTSC signal. They were designed when crystals were expensive, so the original apple based all of it's clocks on divisions and subdivisions of ONE crystal. For that reason, the signal is usually a little skewed from proper NTSC. While not a problem for most televisions, some VCRs and more arcane video equipment (such as camcorders displays or goggles) may have trouble with it. Matthew J Backes bester@earthlink.net -- Subcription/unsubscription/info requests: send e-mail with subject of "subscribe", "unsubscribe", or "info" to wear-hard-request@haven.org Wear-Hard Mailing List Archive (searchable): http://wearables.ml.org From wear-hard-request@haven.org Sun Aug 9 15:55:56 1998 Received: from xenia.media.mit.edu ([18.85.4.17]:4115 "EHLO xenia.media.mit.edu" ident: "NO-IDENT-SERVICE[2]") by picton.eecg.toronto.edu with ESMTP id <34591-21953>; Sun, 9 Aug 1998 15:55:47 -0400 Received: from aleve.media.mit.edu (aleve.media.mit.edu [18.85.2.171]) by xenia.media.mit.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA28895 for ; Sun, 9 Aug 1998 15:55:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from opal.haven.org (list@opal.haven.org [205.161.40.31]) by aleve.media.mit.edu (8.8.7/ML970927) with ESMTP id PAA13448; Sun, 9 Aug 1998 15:54:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from list@localhost) by opal.haven.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA22799; Sun, 9 Aug 1998 15:54:00 -0400 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 15:54:00 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: luthien.arda.org: ladamson owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 03:41:17 -0400 (EDT) From: Lee Adamson X-Sender: ladamson@luthien.arda.org To: Omar Jenkins cc: Wear-Hard Mailing List Subject: Re: Video conversion question... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"vxFQq3.0.rZ5.MvVpr"@opal.haven.org> Resent-From: wear-hard@haven.org X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/4227 X-Loop: wear-hard@haven.org Precedence: list Resent-Sender: wear-hard-request@haven.org Return-Path: X-Orcpt: rfc822;mann@eecg.toronto.edu Status: RO On Sun, 9 Aug 1998, Omar Jenkins wrote: > I'm hoping to find a camcorder viewfinder from my college's surplus store. > And use that if I can figure out the video signals for CGA. You may have to run it in 40x25, if your viewfinder sucks. I had a .5" viewfinder (that died) that didn't like 80x25 at all... But at least it was small (not 7x3x2" :)... Debbie (my SO) is going to talk to an electronics repairman that she knows and see if we can get broken camcorders from him (as he gets them). My first viewfinder cost $5 that way, so if you can't find one at the surplus store, I may be able to get one for you. (from http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/F_Pinouts1.html#PINOUTS_017) CGA: (15.75 KHz - 320x200 or 640x200) DB-9 pin: 1 GND 6 Intensity 2 Unused 7 Unused 3 RED Video 8 H Sync TTL Positive 4 GREEN Video 9 V Sync TTL Positive 5 BLUE Video What the heck is pin 6 for??? Fortunately, CGA is 15.75KHz... Very handy... The conversion circuit would be something like this: (from http://www.hut.fi/Misc/Electronics/circuits/vga2tv/composite_adapter.html, with some changes.) ____ pin 3----------------+-----------|____|----+ | ____ 82 ohm | +-|____|-+ | 180 ohm | | pin 1-------------------------+ | ____ | pin 4----------------------------|____|----+--------> RCA Center Conductor 22 ohm | (Video Out) ____ | pin 5----------------+-----------|____|----+ | ____ 240 ohm | +-|____|-+ | 100 ohm | | pin 1-------------------------+ | ___________ | | Inverter | BC548 ___ | pin 8--|(NOT Gate) |------ __---|___|-+ |___________| \ /| 680 ohm \ / ___________ --------- | Inverter | ____ | pin 9--|(NOT Gate) |--|____|--+ |___________| 1 kohm pin 1-----------------------------------------------> RCA shield (Video Ground) The specs that say that CGA is TTL, so I'm not totally sure if this would work. Additional (transistors||op-amps)&&/||(resistors) may be needed to bring the signal up/down to the correct level... Does anyone have any idea what (if anything) else needs to be done to this circuit? > I just found all the manuals(general, tech specs, software, CMOS, etc) I > also have the installation disks that came with it. BTW: Thee does have > a scanner. Ahhhhh... Can you perchance tell me what the pinouts are for the Keyboard and Internal Expansion ports are? Thanks, -Lee. -- Subcription/unsubscription/info requests: send e-mail with subject of "subscribe", "unsubscribe", or "info" to wear-hard-request@haven.org Wear-Hard Mailing List Archive (searchable): http://wearables.ml.org Message 16/173 From Lee Adamson Aug 9, 98 06:05:56 pm -0400 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 18:04:29 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: luthien.arda.org: ladamson owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 9 Aug 1998 18:05:56 -0400 (EDT) X-Sender: ladamson@luthien.arda.org To: Omar Jenkins cc: Wear-Hard Mailing List Subject: Ooops, I boobooed on that schematic... Resent-Message-ID: <"11mrh3.0.2A6.hpXpr"@opal.haven.org> Resent-From: wear-hard@haven.org X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/4229 X-Loop: wear-hard@haven.org Precedence: list Resent-Sender: wear-hard-request@haven.org Return-Path: X-Orcpt: rfc822;mann@eecg.toronto.edu Tee-hee... Those inverters should be changed to inverting op-amps, as the circuit requires negative sync signals... The way it was would probably not work at all... From wear-hard-request@haven.org Fri Aug 21 18:25:17 1998 Received: from xenia.media.mit.edu ([18.85.4.17]:4277 "EHLO xenia.media.mit.edu" ident: "NO-IDENT-SERVICE[2]") by picton.eecg.toronto.edu with ESMTP id <34571-6561>; Fri, 21 Aug 1998 18:24:55 -0400 Received: from aleve.media.mit.edu (aleve.media.mit.edu [18.85.2.171]) by xenia.media.mit.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA14295 for ; Fri, 21 Aug 1998 18:24:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from opal.haven.org (list@opal.haven.org [205.161.40.31]) by aleve.media.mit.edu (8.8.7/ML970927) with ESMTP id SAA02809; Fri, 21 Aug 1998 18:24:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from list@localhost) by opal.haven.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA06921; Fri, 21 Aug 1998 18:17:33 -0400 Resent-Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1998 18:17:33 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: luthien.arda.org: ladamson owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1998 18:22:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Lee Adamson X-Sender: ladamson@luthien.arda.org Reply-To: Lee Adamson To: wear-hard@haven.org cc: mann@eecg.utoronto.ca Subject: HMD Grooviness (and wonderings)... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"tSdaT3.0.oh1.w7Vtr"@opal.haven.org> Resent-From: wear-hard@haven.org X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/4389 X-Loop: wear-hard@haven.org Precedence: list Resent-Sender: wear-hard-request@haven.org Return-Path: X-Orcpt: rfc822;mann@eecg.toronto.edu Status: RO Now that I have purchased that old Panasonic PK-M003 viewfinder, I have torn it apart and poked about inside with an ohmmeter. (Dr. Mann, you may be interested in this info for the viewfinder section of your website). The pinout of the connector on the viewfinder (Male DIN-8, facing pins) is: 2 5 4 3 1 7 6 1- Camera In (NTSC) 2- +B (+12v. according to my crappy analog VOM) 3- VCR In (NTSC) 4- IND 5- TALLY 6- Camera In Shield 7- VCR In Shield 8- Ground Shield- No Connection (though it is grounded on the camera; makes sense for isolated grounds) I have no idea what IND (pin4) and TALLY (pin5) are for. Can anyone help me out here? That is what was printed on the component side of the PC board. This viewfinder is rather large (5x2.5x2 inches) and heavy, so if I try to mount it vertically in front of my eye, it will slide down. I plan to mount it on the left side of my head, with an IR camera counterweighting on the other side. An adjustable padded velcro band inside of a beret or other floppy hat will be used to tighten it around my head. I will also have a velcro band going over the top of my head, with a female BNC connector sticking out of the top for quick connect of external antennas (when the rubber-ducky inside of my vest goes out of range). Yes, this will look quite funky. Another reason for this choice is that I live in a basement apartment (very low ceilings), and my head just barely clears the doorways. The viewfinder has a pushbutton switch built in to flip between the camera and VCR inputs. I may remove it and interface it to the parallel port (voice activated switching, perhaps switching rapidly between computer output and IR video to produce the effect of text overlayed on the IR image... Assuming that I could figure out some way to synchronize vertical refreshes and switch during them; there's probably an IC that does this...) Along that note (while I'm rambling :)... For all you VGA HMD people using X, why not write a little program that constantly grabs IR images from a QuickCam and draws them on the root window? Another note about this viewfinder is that the focusing lens really sucks. With the lens removed, I can focus on the screen when it is about 4 inches away from my eye. The image doesn't fill very much of my field of view at this distance, but 80x25 text is quite readable. The focusing lens is mounted in a little thingie that flips up out of the way (or at least tries to get out of the way). It can be removed by popping the case off, removing the front panel, and wiggling an exacto-knife, chainsaw, etc around in the 2mm slot in the middle top of the hole that the CRT shows through. Wheee! I'm nearly all 'borged up! -- Subcription/unsubscription/info requests: send e-mail with subject of "subscribe", "unsubscribe", or "info" to wear-hard-request@haven.org Wear-Hard Mailing List Archive (searchable): http://wearables.ml.org From wear-hard-request@haven.org Fri Aug 21 18:41:27 1998 Received: from xenia.media.mit.edu ([18.85.4.17]:4287 "EHLO xenia.media.mit.edu" ident: "NO-IDENT-SERVICE[2]") by picton.eecg.toronto.edu with ESMTP id <34576-6562>; Fri, 21 Aug 1998 18:41:15 -0400 Received: from aleve.media.mit.edu (aleve.media.mit.edu [18.85.2.171]) by xenia.media.mit.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA14451 for ; Fri, 21 Aug 1998 18:41:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from opal.haven.org (list@opal.haven.org [205.161.40.31]) by aleve.media.mit.edu (8.8.7/ML970927) with ESMTP id SAA08007; Fri, 21 Aug 1998 18:41:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from list@localhost) by opal.haven.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA07353; Fri, 21 Aug 1998 18:36:08 -0400 Resent-Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1998 18:36:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: luthien.arda.org: ladamson owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 21 Aug 1998 18:40:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Lee Adamson X-Sender: ladamson@luthien.arda.org To: wear-hard@haven.org Subject: Re: HMD Grooviness (and wonderings)... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"zywRI.0.Yo1.HPVtr"@opal.haven.org> Resent-From: wear-hard@haven.org X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/4390 X-Loop: wear-hard@haven.org Precedence: list Resent-Sender: wear-hard-request@haven.org Return-Path: X-Orcpt: rfc822;mann@eecg.toronto.edu Status: RO On Fri, 21 Aug 1998, Lee Adamson wrote: Oops! The 8th pin is in the middle. :) > 2 > 5 4 > 3 8 1 > 7 6 -- Subcription/unsubscription/info requests: send e-mail with subject of "subscribe", "unsubscribe", or "info" to wear-hard-request@haven.org Wear-Hard Mailing List Archive (searchable): http://wearables.ml.org From wear-hard-request@haven.org Sat Aug 22 14:41:50 1998 Received: from xenia.media.mit.edu ([18.85.4.17]:1056 "EHLO xenia.media.mit.edu" ident: "NO-IDENT-SERVICE[2]") by picton.eecg.toronto.edu with ESMTP id <34586-2025>; Sat, 22 Aug 1998 08:36:27 -0400 Received: from aleve.media.mit.edu (aleve.media.mit.edu [18.85.2.171]) by xenia.media.mit.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA17270 for ; Sat, 22 Aug 1998 08:36:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from opal.haven.org (list@opal.haven.org [205.161.40.31]) by aleve.media.mit.edu (8.8.7/ML970927) with ESMTP id IAA08839; Sat, 22 Aug 1998 08:36:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from list@localhost) by opal.haven.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA13781; Sat, 22 Aug 1998 08:22:40 -0400 Resent-Date: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 08:22:40 -0400 Message-ID: <35DEB612.2215@ns.rochelle.net> Date: Sat, 22 Aug 1998 07:14:10 -0500 From: Michael Sharp Reply-To: mikes@ns.rochelle.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Lee Adamson CC: wear-hard@haven.org Subject: Re: HMD Grooviness (and wonderings)... References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"5NlZZ2.0.wM3.NVhtr"@opal.haven.org> Resent-From: wear-hard@haven.org X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/4395 X-Loop: wear-hard@haven.org Precedence: list Resent-Sender: wear-hard-request@haven.org Return-Path: X-Orcpt: rfc822;mann@eecg.toronto.edu Status: RO Lee Adamson wrote: > I have no idea what IND (pin4) and TALLY (pin5) are for. Can anyone help > me out here? That is what was printed on the component side of the PC > board. I had some very old video equipment once: Two black and white studio cameras, and a video mixer. The mixer had a "tally" on it as well. From what I recall, tally was like a feedback, showing you the return video from a source, but not mixed in with the other signals. Sort like a monitor from what I can guess. > Wheee! I'm nearly all 'borged up! Good luck! If I can ever get my viewfinder to sync I'll be there as well. P)+< <--- "Smiley Borg!" Mike -- Subcription/unsubscription/info requests: send e-mail with subject of "subscribe", "unsubscribe", or "info" to wear-hard-request@haven.org Wear-Hard Mailing List Archive (searchable): http://wearables.ml.org From wear-hard-request@haven.org Thu Sep 3 00:18:21 1998 Received: from xenia.media.mit.edu ([18.85.4.17]:3308 "EHLO xenia.media.mit.edu" ident: "NO-IDENT-SERVICE[2]") by picton.eecg.toronto.edu with ESMTP id <34572-13336>; Thu, 3 Sep 1998 00:18:07 -0400 Received: from aleve.media.mit.edu (aleve.media.mit.edu [18.85.2.171]) by xenia.media.mit.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA09854 for ; Thu, 3 Sep 1998 00:15:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from opal.haven.org (list@opal.haven.org [205.161.40.31]) by aleve.media.mit.edu (8.8.7/ML970927) with ESMTP id AAA30714; Thu, 3 Sep 1998 00:15:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from list@localhost) by opal.haven.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA08013; Thu, 3 Sep 1998 00:04:32 -0400 Resent-Date: Thu, 3 Sep 1998 00:04:32 -0400 Message-ID: <35EE1502.67431BEA@nwlink.com> Date: Wed, 02 Sep 1998 21:03:14 -0700 From: Mark Willis Organization: Who, me?? X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "wear-hard@haven.org" Subject: Viewfinder Questions Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"774gU1.0.ry1.8LXxr"@opal.haven.org> Resent-From: wear-hard@haven.org X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/4558 X-Loop: wear-hard@haven.org Precedence: list Resent-Sender: wear-hard-request@haven.org Return-Path: X-Orcpt: rfc822;mann@eecg.toronto.edu Status: RO Has anyone used the viewfinder from an Olympus VX-303-U color videocamera as an eyepiece for a wearable? I have this camera, it's sorta messed up (plastic handle pieces broken) but fixable - so my question is, I guess, is this '83-manufactured camera likely to give me a "REAL", 80x25 capable eyepiece if I take it apart - or is there a better type of vidcam to be on the lookout for? (I can deal with the PC110 but it'd sure be nice to be able to use an eyepiece as well!) Is there a list on wearcomp.org of the "better" versus the "OK" versus the "Worst" viewfinders, I should be so lucky?!? Mark Willis, mwillis@nwlink.com -- Subcription/unsubscription/info requests: send e-mail with subject of "subscribe", "unsubscribe", or "info" to wear-hard-request@haven.org Wear-Hard Mailing List Archive (searchable): http://wearables.ml.org